MYSTERIOUS DEATH OF: Kaysera Stops Pretty Places

[00:00] Hi, Crime Junkies. It's Britt, and I have big news. One of my favorite seasonal shows, CounterClock, is back with a brand new season, and it is wild. Host Delia D'Ambra is digging into the 2008 Lane Bryant murders. I mean, this isn't just a recap. It is a reinvestigation. She's talking to law enforcement, people from the community, even sources who have never spoken publicly until now. And you know I love a show that asks all the questions. Listen to CounterClock Season 8 now wherever you get your podcasts. [00:31] Hi, Crime Junkies. I'm your host, Ashley Flowers. And I'm Britt. [00:34] And this week, I want to tell you about a young woman from Montana, a girl really, 18 years old and about to finish high school with an appetite for life, big dreams, and a bright future unfolding in front of her. That is, until those dreams and that future were stolen away. [00:52] This is the story of Kaysera Stops Pretty Places. [01:24] So [01:26] It's late in the evening of Saturday, August 24th, 2019, and Yolanda Frazier is waiting to hear from her 18-year-old granddaughter.

[01:36] Kisera had gone out with some friends in Hardin, Montana, about 45 minutes away. [01:41] Kaysera is a member of both the Crow Nation and the Northern Cheyenne tribal communities. And even though she lives on the reservation with her grandmother, who is her legal guardian, she spends a ton of time in Hardin. It's actually where Kaysera is getting ready to start her senior year of high school. [01:57] But anyway, it's been several hours since Yolanda even heard from Kaysera. She hasn't answered any texts or calls, and that's unusual. Especially the texting part, because Yolanda and Kaysera are back and forth all the time. [02:10] But Yolanda knows where Kaysera was planning to be and who she's with, so she's not in a full panic or anything. I mean, Kaysera is 18 years old, she's with friends, and so her grandmother is probably thinking she just got caught up and isn't paying attention to her phone. [02:26] But the next day comes, and there's still no word from Kay Sarah. I mean, it's one thing to decide to stay a little later, even to stay overnight with friends, but Kay Sarah and her mom, Gerilyn, had plans to meet up, and Kay Sarah just never showed up. [02:40] So even though her grandmother is her legal guardian, her mom is still in her life, I guess? Yes, it seems that way. And actually, one of the things that really struck me about this case was just how many close guardian-type figures Kaysera had in her life. Not just parents and grandparents, but aunts and uncles, family friends. So many people who all considered Kaysera pretty much one of their own. [03:04] Luella Bryan and Rusty LaFrance wrote in a piece for the Bighorn County News that in the Crow culture, maternal aunts act as mothers and Kaysera had several aunts who helped raise her, in addition to the many, many more who cared about her and loved her and looked out for her.

[03:21] And one of those people is Kaysera's aunt Priscilla, [03:24] who, according to Pipestem and Nagel Law Firm's website, calls the Bighorn County Sheriff's Office to report Kay Sarah missing that day, on August 25th. Or at least she tries to report her missing. [03:38] Let me guess, they made her wait. [03:40] You bet they did. I mean, what are we talking here, like 24 hours, 12 hours, 48? So it's not clear how long they were told to wait, just that they told her that there was a mandatory waiting period before they could officially file a report. [03:54] *laughs* [03:55] Ashley, I am, one, so tired of hearing about this in general. Yeah. But... [04:00] You said this happened in 2019. That's not that long ago. Like, yeah. [04:05] And you even hear [04:07] Law enforcement say, like, you know, time is the enemy when it comes to missing people. We have a show, right? The First 48. Exactly. Like, it's a thing. It's a thing. Like, I don't understand this at all. And the only thing I can think of, at least in this case, is do they act like this because, you know, Kaysera's 18 and she's legally an adult? No, I don't think we can even argue that they viewed her as an adult, or at least they shouldn't have by their own standards, because in Montana, anyone under 21 is considered a child. [04:37] can't wait even two days. Right. According to the state legislature's website, law enforcement is required to get the missing person's information into their system within two hours of getting a call. [04:49] And now not to give law enforcement any kind of a pass here, but what they would probably argue if we asked them is that Kaysera did have a history of running away, at least according to comments Kaysera's aunt made in the Billings Gazette.

[05:02] And she hadn't just run away before. The family had actually reported her missing before, too. [05:07] Okay, so there's no way that that couldn't have impacted the way police treated Kaysera's disappearance. Like, I remember back, and this is a throwback in the Misty Copsey episode, that... [05:17] her mom had reported her missing at one point in time [05:20] It was a misunderstanding. She came home, but the missing persons report was never canceled and it got messy when Misty actually went missing. Yeah. And I don't know the situation of like, you know, is that what happened here? Did she still have an open file or were they just like, this has happened before? She'll probably come back this time. I don't know. [05:38] And I don't know what happens over the next couple of days. It's actually pretty hard to pin down. But I do know that the family emails pictures of Kaysera to police. [05:47] Apart from that, there's no public record of what, if anything, happens from an investigative standpoint. [05:53] I mean, [05:54] Probably like calling friends, classmates, doing a driving sweep around the area where she was last seen. I would imagine like tracking down the people that she was hanging out with that night. I mean, basic things. It depends on who you're talking about because honestly, I'm not sure that police were doing any of that stuff or anything else for that matter. I couldn't find any record of anything happening from the police side. There's no public announcements, no media coverage, nothing.

[06:24] period. Wait, so… [06:25] An 18-year-old girl goes missing and there's just no one out looking for her. Well, no police are out looking for her as far as I can tell, but her family certainly is. They're looking and praying and hoping Kaysera is going to walk through the door. But it's hard to stay hopeful. I mean, we all know the statistics by now about missing and murdered indigenous women and girls and about how much more likely they are to be victims of violent crime. [06:55] the highest percentage of missing and murdered indigenous people, men, women, boys, girls, in the whole state. And according to a documentary released in May 2021 called Say Her Name, the highest rate of MMIWG per capita in the U.S. Oh, my God. And Kaysera's family knows that risk all too well because they've lived it. [07:19] In that documentary, they talk about how just a couple of months earlier, in July, Kaysera had been in Missoula. [07:27] She had been planning to board a bus home for the 4th of July powwow, but never made it onto the bus. [07:33] Instead, she was taken to an isolated location in the town of Pryor, an area described in the documentary as, quote, [07:41] the epicenter of meth distribution and human trafficking that is central to the MMIWG crisis, end quote, and she was held there against her will. [07:52] Now, somehow, miraculously, Kaysera had escaped that situation, which is pretty incredible considering how many women, how many indigenous women in particular, don't.

[08:04] Okay. [08:04] Wait, if the police aren't taking this seriously because she was a runaway before, she's also been kidnapped before. [08:13] Like the month before. Like, can we if we're going to say like, oh, she's ran away before. We can't pay attention to it. [08:19] We also have to say, oh, she's been kidnapped before. [08:23] We have to pay attention to it, right? Right. [08:25] Exactly. But here's the thing. I'm not even sure that that incident was ever reported to police. If so, they don't mention it in the documentary. But regardless of whether or not police knew about the kidnapping and her escape, Kaysera's family certainly knows. And it's got to be playing in the backs of their minds while they're searching for her this time. [08:45] So [08:46] It's around this time, a week after Kaysera was last seen, that a rumor starts floating around town. A rumor that somebody found a body. [08:59] So many people are focused on where their money is today. Acorns is the financial wellness app that cares about where your money is going tomorrow. And with the Acorns Potential screen, you can find out what your money is truly capable of. It's super easy. You can sign up in minutes and start automatically investing your spare money, even if all you've got is spare change. The Acorns Potential screen shows you the power of compounding and how your money could grow over time. Plus, you can quickly adjust how much you're investing to make sure you're building towards your goals. [09:29] Acorns grows with you. Whether you're just starting out or thinking about settling down, Acorns supports your big and small goals across every stage of life. Sign up now and Acorns will boost your new account with a $5 bonus investment. Join the over 14 million all-time customers who have already saved and invested over $27 billion with Acorns. Head to acorns.com slash crimejunkie or download the Acorns app to get started. Paid non-client endorsement. Compensation provides an incentive to positively promote Acorns. Tier 2 compensation provided.

[09:59] such as customers' accounts, ages, and investment settings. Does not include Acorns fees. Results do not predict or represent the performance of any Acorns portfolio. Investment results may vary. Investing involves risk. Acorns Advisors, LLC, and SEC-registered investment advisor. View important disclosures at acorns.com slash crimejunkie. [10:18] On August 31st, Yolanda gets a call from her brother saying there's a rumor going around on Twitter that the body of a young girl has been found in Hardin and not just any young girl, a stops girl. [10:33] Wait, what? [10:34] Well, apparently, two days before, on August 29th, a man had been jogging alongside a road in Hardin when he made a disturbing discovery. [10:43] According to Juliana Sukut's reporting for the Billings Gazette, what this guy sees in the backyard of this house is the body of a girl, maybe a young woman. He doesn't know. And the body is dead. [10:56] face down [10:57] wrapped in plastic and sort of hidden behind a woodpile. Somehow, word of this discovery makes its way to Kaysera's aunt Priscilla. [11:08] I honestly don't know how she knew about it since it didn't even make the news, which [11:13] in and of itself, it just like blows my mind. Yeah. But according to the family's timeline of events published on the Pipestem and Nagel website, [11:22] Priscilla actually shows up there at the crime scene worried that it might be her missing niece. But when she got there, the officer at the scene wouldn't tell her if the body was Kaysera's. And the officer refused to let her make any kind of identification for herself, even though she offered.

[11:40] I mean, I get that, it's a crime scene. [11:43] I would have said the same, except it doesn't seem like police treated it like a crime scene at all. Kaysera's grandmother, Yolanda, says in the documentary that the jogger who found the body that day, he saw people walking in and out of the yard where Kaysera was found. And he is the one who said, like, [12:04] Hey, shouldn't this be, like, secured? Yeah, I mean, why wouldn't they be treating finding a body as a crime scene? Honestly, I have no idea. I tried to track down an explanation, but I couldn't find one. If I had to guess the answer as to why the crime scene wasn't secured, and to many, many other questions in this case... [12:25] is really steeped in systemic racism and the preconceived notions many people, law enforcement included, law enforcement especially, hold when it comes to indigenous people. Like, for example, Yolanda says in the Say Her Name documentary that at some point while Kaysera was missing, a police officer said to the family, oh, she's just probably out partying. She'll be back. [12:48] Clearly, though, Kaysera's family doesn't agree. I mean, some part of them is hoping that she's out there somewhere. And honestly, that would be the best case scenario at this point. But they can't even ignore the worst case scenarios either. I mean, if there is a dead girl, a dead teenage stops girl, who else could it be, really? [13:08] So once these rumors start going around, Yolanda calls Kaysera's mom, Gerilyn, to let her know what she's heard and to see if she could check it out and find out if there's any validity to what's being said.

[13:20] Okay, but this could be, you know, kind of a "no news is good news" situation, right? Like, by the time her family is hearing about this, the body had been found two days earlier. [13:30] Surely they would have been notified and contacted by now, right?" [13:34] You'd hope, but I mean, you aren't an indigenous person in Montana. And because of their history with law enforcement, no news doesn't necessarily mean good news. I mean, no news all too often means being ignored or just dismissed. So Gerilyn isn't going to just wait for the phone to ring. She wants to know right now if there's any truth to this rumor, if the nightmare that they've all been living in for the last week might actually be coming true. So she and Priscilla head to the local mortuary to check it out. [14:04] But when they arrive, whoever they speak to at Bullis Mortuary tells them, "No, [14:09] It's not Quesera. [14:12] Gerilyn and Priscilla breathe a huge sigh of relief and head home to continue their own search, to continue with this roller coaster of hopeful peaks and then really awful valleys. And every day that passes without any word from Kay Sarah or an update from police is another day of wondering whether Kay Sarah will ever come home and if they will ever know what happened to her. [14:36] Then, on September 11th, almost three weeks after she first went missing, Kaysera's family gets the news that makes their heads spin. [14:45] Because you see, [14:47] That body that the jogger found next to the woodpile in Hardin

[14:52] It turns out, [14:53] That was Kaysera. [14:55] Wait, how? I mean, they said it wasn't her. Listen, what? [14:59] I know what they said. [15:00] Okay, but, like, why is the family only finding out now? [15:04] I wish I could tell you. It seems almost impossible to believe that it took two weeks to identify her, especially considering police knew Kay Sarah was missing. Remember, she'd been reported missing by her family. Well, and her family was going straight to police saying, hey, is it her? [15:34] But like you said, beyond that, her aunt literally showed up at the crime scene, handed them their first lead on a silver platter saying like, hey, is this my niece? Let me take a look at her. Like, let me try and help out. And then they have family member go to the mortuary and say, hey, we just want to like double check. You wouldn't let us check before. And like they get stopped at every single turn. [15:57] Are these investigators just, like, really terrible at their jobs and, like, couldn't figure this out, even with, like you said, all this information? Or... [16:06] did they actually know it was her this whole time? And we're just like, [16:11] Uh-uh. [16:12] We can wait to tell the family. Yolanda thinks it's the latter. She thinks that they 100% knew it was Kaysera and just didn't notify the family. But in my mind, no matter which way you slice it, this is a very bad look for police and kind of proves what so many people have been screaming at the top of their lungs for so long about systemic racism between law enforcement and the indigenous communities they serve.

[16:40] So of course, this entire family is heartbroken and devastated. As you can imagine, Gerilyn is eager to bring her daughter's body home for a proper ceremony and burial. But it turns out that's not going to be as straightforward as it sounds. Because even though Kaysera's body was found in Hardin, her remains are actually at the Montana Department of Justice Crime Lab at this point, [17:10] is on the reservation. [17:12] But... [17:12] Didn't you just say that her body was at the local mortuary like a week ago? I guess I assumed that was in Hardin. So you're right. But here is where things start to go even more sideways. So just real quick, let me recap this like part of this timeline, according to the family as published on the Pipestem and Nagle website. So on August 31st, that's when Yolanda hears this rumor going around about the body of a stops girl being found and it being at the Bullis Mortuary in Hardin. And she calls Gerilyn to tell her this. [17:42] On September 1st, Gerilyn and Persilia go to the mortuary and are told it isn't Kaysera. [17:48] Not there's nobody here, not I don't know what you're talking about, we don't know. It's not her. Then it's not until September 11th, 10 days later, that they find out it was Kaysera all along. [18:00] Now, initially, the family decides that they'll just work with a local funeral home in Billings, since that's where her body is, instead of transporting it back to Hardin. But the Bighorn County coroner at the time, this guy named Terry Bullis, is like, no, no, no, no, don't do that. Use a local one. And specifically, he wants them to use his funeral home.

[18:24] Bullis Mortuary [18:26] So he's the county coroner and the owner of the funeral home? Like, it's the same guy? [18:31] Same guy, but two separate jobs. One as an elected official and the other as a private business owner or... [18:40] Let me say this: they're at least supposed to be two separate jobs. [18:44] According to Kaysera's family, Terry tells Kaysera's mom, Jerilyn, that in order to even get Kaysera's remains back from the crime lab, she'll have to cremate the body first. [18:57] I'm sorry. [18:58] "What? Like, one, I don't even know which hat he's wearing when he's saying this, but…" "I don't think they do either." "Regardless, can he even do that?" Not in any official way as far as I can tell. [19:09] I'm not a lawyer, but I can't imagine there's anything in Montana law demanding cremation of a body, especially one that may be a victim of a crime, before it's transported back to the family for proper burial. Like, why? [19:23] People have a right to choose what happens to their remains after they die. Or in Kaysera's case, as a minor, her family has that right. Right. [19:31] But legal or not, this is what Gerilyn is told. And so Gerilyn agrees, and according to the family, Terry orders the cremation right away. [19:41] But... [19:42] Isn't, like you said, Kaysera's body is a victim of a crime? Like, this is an open investigation. Can he even do that? [19:50] Like, timeline aside from all of this and, like, her being the victim of a crime and should we cremate? Like, even if this wasn't an open investigation, it doesn't matter how a person dies. The decision to cremate remains is up to the family or written in a will. It is not up to the county coroner or the owner of a funeral home who is being paid to do the cremation. Or a person who does both of those things at the same time.

[20:20] if they thought they had any other choice because cremation is actually against their cultural beliefs. I mean, but of course she felt backed into this corner. Like... [20:28] He is the county coroner. He's in this position of authority in this situation. I mean, I think it'd be tough for anyone to question the direction coming from the county coroner, not to mention she is... [20:40] in like the throes of grief. Who knows where her heart and her mind is and like where her capacity is to even process what's going on and make a decision other than like just get my baby home. Yeah, right. [20:53] But I mean, did they at least do an autopsy before she was cremated? [20:57] So I guess that is the glimmer of good news here because yes, there was an autopsy. [21:02] Now, [21:03] No one seems to know exactly when it happened. Kaysera's family was told the autopsy took place on the 27th, which is two days before her body was even found, but okay. [21:14] Anyway, the coroner tells Gerald Lynn it's going to take three to four weeks before the family will see a final report, which is an eternity for a family desperate for answers, desperate to know what exactly happened to Kay Sarah and who's responsible. [21:29] It would be an agonizing wait. But the coroner said that while he can't provide the final report until it's done, he was willing to tell Gerilyn [21:38] what it's going to say. [21:42] For decades, some cold cases have been reduced to files in a cabinet, but not anymore. I'm Ashley Flowers, and me and my team on the deck have been traveling across the country to report on these forgotten cases. And in some instances, it's resulted in these cases being solved after decades. So

[22:02] Join me every Wednesday as we revive these stories one card at a time. Listen to the deck now. [22:09] wherever you get your podcasts. [22:12] According to the family's timeline of events, Terry, our coroner slash funeral home owner, basically tells the family that the report is going to say that Kaysera's cause of death will be, quote, exposure to alcohol or substance, end quote. [22:31] exposure to alcohol or substance? Like alcohol poisoning or an accidental overdose? That's what [22:40] My thought was initially, like, again, that's literally the exact phrasing that they use, but I think... [22:46] It might actually be exposure due to alcohol or drug use, which is like a cause of death that the people of Bighorn County see a lot from this coroner. It's kind of like his go-to. [22:55] Okay, but exposure, like hypothermia in late August, that kind of seems more like a winter thing. [23:02] So, [23:03] Apparently not. Interesting fact, more people die of exposure in the summer than in the winter, at least according to the Farmer's Almanac, because people are less likely to be prepared for cold temperatures in the warmer months. Oh, I learned something today. [23:18] Yeah, but the county attorney isn't entirely on board with the coroner's ruling. [23:23] Just a few days after the family had that conversation with the coroner about what the autopsy was going to show, they sit down with the county attorney. And right here, I have this whole like quote. It's basically the family's summary of that meeting. If you can kind of like summarize it for us.

[23:40] So the way the family puts it is basically they were told that it was really confusing as to who was leading the investigation. There was reorganization and... [23:49] quote, general turmoil in the sheriff's office, end quote. And he also pointed out what we said, that Terry Bullis had a potential conflict of interest as both the business owner of the [24:02] elected county coroner. You don't say. Right. And he also said that Terry Bullis tends to make a quick decision on cause of death as exposure to alcohol and natural causes. Like, like you said earlier, it's kind of his go to. [24:17] So like you said in that summary, the county attorney says that he isn't sure who's running the investigation. But as far as I can tell, the family is running the investigation themselves and handing tips and information over to the authorities. [24:31] And that's what they do for the next three months, all the while trying to navigate their way through Bighorn County's tangled mess of a justice system, trying to figure out what exactly happened to Kay Sarah. And all the while they're holding vigils and rallies and protests demanding justice. [24:49] And I mean, just think about that for a second. Like, this is a grieving family. And instead of this... [24:55] law enforcement community closing ranks around them to support them through this completely unimaginable situation. [25:02] they're basically left, like you said, running the investigation by themselves and organizing protests to get attention. [25:10] I know this isn't an experience exclusive to indigenous families either. Like lots of families and lots of cases that we've covered, you know, find themselves in these situations. And the first example that comes to mind, for me at least, is Vanessa Guillen's family who were forced to do basically the exact same thing. And it's,

[25:28] It's frustrating just to see how different people's experiences with law enforcement can be depending on who they are, [25:35] where they come from and what they look like. [25:38] Yeah. And I mean, in this case, it, it, [25:41] It seems like even the most straightforward of questions from Kaysera's family are... [25:46] constantly met with these like confusing non-answers. [25:50] According to the pipe stem and Nagel's timeline of events, the family waits a full 15 weeks to finally get the results of Kaysera's autopsy. Not the three to four that Terry Bullis said it might take. I was going to say, that's like, what, five times longer than they were told? Fifteen. [26:08] Teen. [26:09] weeks. But they have it now. [26:12] Unfortunately, if you were thinking this is the part of the story where you learn the truth about what happened to Kaysera, you'd be wrong. Instead of giving the family answers to their questions, what they end up with is just... [26:25] More. [26:26] questions. Like, [26:27] Cause of death? [26:29] undetermined. What? Yeah. I thought the coroner told the family it was going to say that she died from exposure or an overdose or whatever the heck he said he was going to write down. [26:39] Mm-hmm, he did say that, at least according to the family's versions of events on their law firm's website. [26:46] As Julianna Sucoup reported in another one of her pieces for the Billings Gazette, the medical examiners were able to rule a few things out. There was no evidence of injury or disease, but there was nothing in the autopsy or toxicology that pointed to a specific cause or manner of death.

[27:05] Okay, so... [27:06] When he said exposure... [27:09] to or due to alcohol or substance or whatever, he didn't have a toxicology. Yeah. So like from what I can tell, if this is the official report and the toxicology is coming back saying there's nothing that points to like any cause or manner of death, then he's literally just making assumptions about this young woman on his table because of her race, because of her age, because of where she is, whatever. That basically like, oh, we're definitely going to find drugs or alcohol. He was like closing his eyes and checking a box, essentially. [27:38] Yeah, which is like, again, what he's been accused of over and over is he's just got this general rule. Like you meet these like certain parameters and check, check, check. OK, but going back to the official report... [27:49] 18-year-old women don't just die. And if they do, you know, a heart condition or something. [27:57] they don't end up wrapped in plastic and... [28:00] dumped [28:01] behind someone's woodpile. [28:03] I totally agree. And the Bighorn County attorney, Jay Harris, does too. And even though there isn't enough evidence to conclusively give a cause or manner of death, there is enough for him to tell the Billings Gazette he considers her death to be, quote, suspicious. [28:18] But from her family's perspective, Kaysera's death is more than just suspicious. They're certain there is foul play here. That Kaysera was murdered. Not only because, like you said, 18 year olds don't just die of natural causes and end up [28:33] wrapped in plastic in someone's backyard, but also because of the discrepancy between when Kaysera died and when her body was found.

[28:43] What the coroner told the family is that Kaysera died on August 26th, and that means she'd been dead three days by the time anyone discovered her body. Now, the family doesn't believe for a second that Kaysera's body laid there for three days unnoticed. And in fact, in the Say Her Name documentary, Yolanda goes back to visit the site where Kaysera's body was found. And I don't think anybody could lie there for even three hours, let alone three days with no one seeing it. [29:13] visible to anyone driving along or walking down the street. And this is not like a quiet, dead-end street. It is one of the busiest streets in Hardin. [29:22] So if she died on the 26th, [29:24] Is Yolanda thinking she died somewhere else and the body was moved to that backyard later? Yeah. Yeah, that's exactly what the family thinks. Yolanda actually told Bighorn County News that on the day K. Sarah's body was discovered, the grass under her body was green, which you'd expect that if she had been there all that time, the grass would be dead underneath her, especially if she was covered in plastic that whole time. [29:49] Right. You'd expect it to be yellow and wilting and gross. Yes. So does anyone [29:55] live in the house where Kaysera was found? Yeah, the house is owned by a guy named Steve Schaff. And there isn't a ton of information out there about him, but from what I understand, he didn't know Kaysera and she didn't know him. And he told the Billings Gazette that he was actually out of town on the day her body was found in his yard and that was his son who called him to tell him what was going on.

[30:19] Like out of town for just that day or like an extended time, like a week or something? I think just that day. I mean, what he says in the Billings Gazette article is that he was in Billings, like 45 minutes away, buying auto parts. So I don't think he was like on vacation or anything, though it's not clear whether or not he was home before that. Like, again, on the 26th, when Kay Sarah was said to have actually died. Mm hmm. [30:42] I think it's safe to assume he didn't just like miss a body laying in his yard for several days at the end of August. So either he wasn't home or she wasn't there. [30:51] Or he's lying. Or he's lying, but there is nothing to indicate he's been dishonest at all. Like, I haven't found anything that questions that. [30:59] Okay, but I have so many questions about this. Like, what's this guy's deal? The son who called to tell him there was a body in the yard does... [31:06] he live at the house too? Does anyone else live there? Are we certain K-Sara didn't have... [31:11] any connection to the home, like, at all? Like, the son, the neighbors, anything? Girl, I wish I had the answers to any of those questions, because I have all those questions, too, but I don't. [31:23] I am so frustrated. So, [31:24] Have there been [31:25] Any suspects or persons of interest in Kaysera's case? Law enforcement hasn't named any. But then again, from their perspective, I'm not sure there's even a crime to investigate the way that they're looking at this. I mean, the only public official who has said anything remotely close to acknowledging that there might be something fishy going on is the Bighorn County attorney. And all he's saying is it's suspicious.

[31:51] But there is one other thing I need to tell you about. Something that happened in the days before Kaysera went missing. And it connects Kaysera to someone investigating her death. [32:06] For decades, some cold cases have been reduced to files in a cabinet, but not anymore. I'm Ashley Flowers, and me and my team on the deck have been traveling across the country to report on these forgotten cases. And in some instances, it's resulted in these cases being solved after decades. [32:26] Join me every Wednesday as we revive these stories one card at a time. Listen to the deck now. [32:33] wherever you get your podcasts. [32:37] Just days before Kaysera's body was found in that backyard in Hardin, she witnessed a crime. She and her brother were at Crow Fair, which is this huge, like, days-long cultural event that happens every year during the third week of August. And during that event, her brother, who was in a wheelchair at the time, was beaten and physically restrained, not just by anyone, but by a law enforcement officer. [33:07] people on the scene when Kaysera's body was found that day in Hardin. What? The New York Times reported that this guy was even one of the lead investigators on her case at one point. No. Yes. I wasn't able to find any information about what led up to Kaysera's brother being beaten, but according to the Pipestem and Nagel website, Kaysera filmed the whole thing and posted it to her social media channels.

[33:37] Division actually stepped in to do an investigation and ended up reprimanding the officers who were involved. [33:43] And even though no one is outright saying K-Sara's death is connected to this assault, the whole thing just raises a bunch of red flags. I mean, at this point, this entire case is a pile of red flags. Right? Okay, so we are in summer 2021, almost two years later. [34:03] Has there been... [34:04] any movement on Kaysera's case? [34:06] The short answer is no. But in October 2019, the county attorney announced he was creating a new task force to focus on investigating suspicious deaths and missing persons and murder cases. And that was a direct result of a march Kaysera's family organized that ended with 100 people in red t-shirts protesting on the steps of the Bighorn County Courthouse. [34:29] According to a piece published by the Missoula Current, this task force was put in place to investigate active cases, but also to look at policies and jurisdictional issues, which are a huge problem in Montana and many other places. Yeah, and I know that jurisdiction can get tricky with cases on reservations, like just in terms of, you know, [34:50] Who's supposed to go where? Who's supposed to take the lead? Is that something that's happening in Kaysera's case too? [34:56] Oh, absolutely. The attorney representing Kaysera's family, Mary Catherine Nagel, talked about this on Democracy Now! News in October of 2019. Because Kaysera's body was found in Hardin, it was just off the Crow Reservation, like just barely off, which means the state and local law enforcement has jurisdiction.

[35:17] When Kaysera's family got fed up with how little the county sheriffs were doing in terms of their investigation, they actually reached out to the FBI to ask them to take over the case. And according to the family, basically the FBI said, like, sorry, no can do because we don't have jurisdiction. But... [35:32] What about the reservation? Like, wouldn't that be federal territory? No. [35:36] That would have been. According to a story by Molly McCluskey for Al Jazeera, the FBI is responsible for investigating kidnappings and homicides that occur on tribal lands. [35:47] Okay, so what's the issue? [35:51] Well, I mean, for the FBI, first of all, Kaysera's body wasn't found on the reservation. It was found half a mile outside the Crow Nation boundary. But even if they did have jurisdiction, they wouldn't even get involved anyway, apparently, unless there is clear evidence of foul play. [36:07] Okay, but no one is investigating this. How do you prove foul play if no one's looking at it? [36:13] Great question. Again, again, [36:15] Wrapped in plastic to me like screams foul play. And if that's not screaming that to everyone else, I have no idea. [36:28] Was there even an open case? [36:30] I don't know. Yeah. I mean, as far as I know, there's no active investigation into Kay Sarah's case. Police don't even think that there was a crime committed in the case. And maybe they have information that they're not sharing with the public or even the family. But to me, it seems unlikely. In my mind, you can't close a suspicious death case until you rule out foul play. And that has not happened. Right. And I mean, haven't you even said before, like, investigators are trained to treat every suspicious death as a homicide?

[37:00] Until they can say it is. [37:02] Absolutely wasn't. [37:03] But they're supposed to write. That's how you're supposed to work an investigation. But unfortunately, not all investigators do that. And I think that's when you see cases like this or cases that get so jumbled when you go in with these preconceived notions or these assumptions. [37:17] And again, I'm not sure you can call finding an 18-year-old girl's body laying face down in someone's backyard, I'll say it one more time, wrapped in plastic, anything other than suspicious. Or connected to foul play. [37:32] Mm hmm. OK, Sarah deserves justice. Her family deserves answers. And I don't know about you, but I want 2021 to be the year they finally get those answers. [37:44] When we were researching this episode, we came across a change.org petition that the family is hoping that they can use to put some pressure on law enforcement at all levels to reopen the investigation into Kay Sarah's death. We are going to link to that on our website and in the show notes. Literally, it could not be easier for you, our listeners, to look down at your device and make a single decision. [38:08] Click. [38:09] As of this recording, they have just over 6,700 signatures. I need you guys to hear me. I am counting on you crime junkies to get that number right. [38:19] Much, much, much. [38:21] Hire. I signed it. Britt, you signed it. Of course. [38:25] I've said this before, and I will say it until our very last episode, until I'm blue in the face. These are real people. If Kay Sarah was your sister, wouldn't you want someone who spent 40 minutes listening to her story of her death to take two minutes to help you get the answers you deserve? I'm not kidding you. Two minutes tops. And I'll never forget. I remember we did our episode on Alyssa Turney. I told our listeners kind of the same thing. I said, you owe it to Sarah Turney to help her.

[38:55] people who were mad at me emailed in wrote bad reviews said they didn't owe me anything and basically to like shut up and tell stories and part of that's right you don't owe me anything but you owe the people in these stories that you are listening to everything 1000% now I know that's not most of you we have a wonderful audience and you guys have a lot of power I know there are millions of you listening each week [39:23] millions. There isn't a reason in the world that that petition shouldn't have millions of signatures. If you are going to be interested in true crime, you have to be a responsible consumer of true crime. And that means using your voice, using what you have to make a difference. I'm not asking for you to give a dime. I'm not asking for you to take chunks out of your day. Two minutes. You spent 40 minutes listening to this episode. You can take two minutes to make sure this girl gets [39:53] Bighorn County needs to know that the world is paying attention, not just to what's happening or not happening in Kaysera's case, but what's happening in that county overall. Because here's the thing, Kaysera's death is far from an isolated incident, not even close. There are so many stories of young people from right there in Bighorn County that sound just like hers, shockingly like hers. [40:23] 14-year-old indigenous girl from the Northern Cheyenne Indian Reservation named Henny Scott didn't come home when she was expected. She called her mother earlier in the day to ask if she could go to a basketball game. And even though her mother said no, because Henny was grounded at the time, she figured, you know, maybe Henny just went anyway because, you know. Teenagers, right. Totally. Right.

[40:46] Now, Henny's parents went to Billings looking for her, and they posted to social media hoping maybe someone had seen her and would let them know. But no luck. So that's when they reported her missing to authorities. And do you want to know what they said? [41:00] I mean... [41:01] Do I actually want to know? Well, according to a piece by author Cindy Chang on the investigations for the missing blog, Henny's mother said she was, quote, dismissed by the police and asked if she had checked with friends and that maybe Henny had a new boyfriend. [41:19] Now, normally, I would go on to tell you a story about what law enforcement did at this point. But in this case, I'll have to settle for telling you what they didn't do. They didn't issue an Amber Alert or any kind of missing persons alert to law enforcement for two weeks. They didn't do any kind of official police search for Henny. The tribal community was left to do that. And they didn't take her disappearance seriously at all. [41:49] three weeks before her body was found, covered in snow about 200 yards from the house where she was last seen. Wait, three weeks? Three weeks. [42:02] weeks. And what was the cause of death in the end? Well, our favorite coroner, Terry Bullis, ruled her death an accident. Hypothermia with alcohol as a contributing factor. Now, the FBI did come in and investigate and they agreed. And listen, it was December, so maybe. But nothing about the Bighorn County coroner gives me any kind of confidence. And in case you need another reason

[42:32] 4, 2013, a 21-year-old mother of a 10-month-old boy named Hannah Harris headed out to a fireworks party with some friends. [42:41] A few hours later, her car was found abandoned on the side of the road with a flat tire. But there was no sign of Hannah. [42:48] Then, according to an episode of True Life Crime called Mom Gone Missing, on July 8th, searchers found her body deep in the woods on the northern Cheyenne reservation. Her shirt was pulled up and her pants were pulled down. [43:04] Top-notch county coroner Terry Bullis wasn't able to determine a cause of death for Hannah, saying that her body was already too badly decomposed. After four days? Apparently. I mean, he wasn't able to determine much of anything, really. Like, he couldn't tell, like I said, how she died or even whether or not she'd been sexually assaulted. Like, very basic stuff. Again, like you said, after four days. Okay, but like, her shirt was pulled up, her pants were pulled down. [43:34] There's foul play somewhere in here. Yeah, and listen, you're right, because ultimately we know Hannah was murdered. But it wasn't the coroner who figured that out. The investigation did. [43:47] Not even police's investigation. It was Hannah's mother's investigation. [43:53] According to a piece by Molly McCluskey for Al Jazeera, quote, It was Hannah's mother who tracked down the couple who had killed her daughter, asking friends for information, requesting footage from CCTV cameras where she'd last been seen, and compiling the evidence to present to the police who had repeatedly brushed off her attempts to report Hannah missing.

[44:16] End quote. [44:17] So... [44:18] She does all this investigation for the police, [44:21] Wraps it in a pretty bow and everything and just literally gives it to them because they did nothing. Oh my god. So did their work for them. [44:28] Was this couple ever arrested? Yes. So nine months after her death and only after significant community pressure... [44:37] It turned out Hannah had been sexually assaulted. She'd been beaten and strangled by a man and woman. Wait, wait, wait. She was beaten to death and strangled? [44:49] by two assailants. - Yeah. [44:52] within four days, her body was too decomposed to be able to tell any of that. Is that what you're saying? [44:57] That's what Terry Bullis said, that he couldn't tell if she was beaten, strangled, and sexually assaulted. [45:04] But the interesting thing is like the people who did this were both people who had been at the party with her that night. [45:11] Ultimately, the woman was sentenced to 22 years for second-degree murder and the man 10 years for his role in dumping Hannah's body. [45:19] Now, it's because of her death that Montana passed Hannah's act, which led to a new dedicated position for a missing person specialist to help quickly organize searches when people are reported missing in Montana, especially indigenous people. And Hannah's law bounced around the Montana legislature for a while and was ultimately signed into law in May 2019, before Kay Sarah was reported missing.

[45:49] didn't start until the week of September 11th, so after Kaysera's body had been found. Okay, but I mean, the fact that we even need a law to... [45:59] drive police to do [46:01] Legitimately what their job is, is beyond me. Yeah, but we do. And it's not just Hannah's act. There is also the Not Invisible Act. And Savannah's act from the story you shared a couple months ago back in the fan club. Right. Savannah LaFontaine Greywind. All of these are great pieces of legislation, all very important. [46:31] girls after those women and girls have been failed by police. Like it shouldn't take a tragedy to spur action. These women and girls, they shouldn't be dying at the hands of murderers and they shouldn't be dying of hypothermia in the field either. And their families shouldn't be dismissed by police, period, when that happens. Okay, Sarah and Henny and Hannah and the many, many missing [47:01] better than this and their families deserve better too. [47:05] I know there are a lot of people in this country who have fought hard for change when it comes to missing and murdered indigenous women and girls. And I can't even imagine where we would be without them. I mean, sustaining that kind of advocacy for that long has to be exhausting.

[47:21] We need to get in there, you guys. Maybe you're not going to show up on TV or participate in a public march, and that's okay. But there are lots of things that you can do to help and you should do to help support the effort. Like we talked about earlier, you can sign the Justice for Case Sarah petition, which again is linked right here in the show notes. You can write to the Bighorn County Sheriff and demand that Case Sarah's case be reopened. We'll have that contact information on our blog post. [47:51] And if you're actually in Bighorn County when election time comes around again in 2022, you can vote for people who commit to making things better for indigenous women and girls. I need you guys to hear me when I say this. Everyone gets all up in a tizzy about presidential elections. The ones that really matter, the ones that will affect you if something happens to someone you love are the local ones. [48:21] County attorney, your coroner. [48:24] Yeah, and I mean, for God's sake, Bighorn County, [48:26] Get rid of Terry Bullis. Well, actually, I've got somewhat of good news here. He actually left the position back in November 2020. But the guy who replaced him is this guy named Daryl Nordquist. He was just charged with felony theft for purchasing stolen motorcycles and SUVs. Now, what's interesting, there's no website for the county coroner that I could find. So I'm not even sure... [48:51] If anyone's in the role right now,

[48:54] But elections coming up, folks, like, again, you can actually make a difference if you live there. Well, and at this point, the bar is so low, you can step over it. [49:05] But whoever comes into this position now as coroner, you got to do more than step over it. Bighorn County needs somebody to raise that bar in a... [49:13] big [49:14] way. So true. Because Kaysera's family still doesn't know the truth about what happened to her, or when, nor do they know how her body ended up in a stranger's backyard in Hardin. [49:26] I know I want that change, and I hope that you guys want that change enough to do something about it. So one more time, the link to the Justice for Kaysera petition is on our website and right here in the show notes, along with contact information for the local sheriff if you want to write directly to them. Let's show Kaysera's family how much she and her story matters. And let's show Bighorn County what crime junkies are really made of. [49:55] you can find all of the source material and information for this episode on our website crimejunkiepodcast.com and be sure to follow us on instagram at crimejunkie podcast and we'll be back next week with a brand new episode

[50:25] Thank you. [50:50] you [50:50] you [50:51] you [50:52] *music* [50:55] Crime Junkie is an AudioChuck production. [50:58] So? [50:59] What do you think, Chuck? [51:00] Do you approve? [51:01] *Mario grunts* [51:04] Okay, crime junkies, you know I absolutely love a twist and a turn, especially when it comes to people who turn out to be someone they're not. That's why I have been obsessed with the podcast Chameleon. Every Thursday, host Josh Dean deep dives into a scam so bizarre, it will leave you wondering, how did they get away with that? [51:23] It is truly one of my favorite podcasts right now and I've been listening for years. [51:27] I think you'll love it too. [51:28] Listen to Chameleon wherever you get your podcasts.