Sunday Special: The 10 Best Horror Movie Franchises

[00:00] Innovation loves speed. [00:01] Risk doesn't. [00:03] For most organizations, that tension never goes away. [00:06] Every time a new AI capability appears, the pressure to move fast collides with the responsibility to move safely. [00:13] One Trust is built for this moment. [00:16] Their AI-ready governance platform provides context to understand your data, controls to stay ahead of risk, and confidence to act boldly. [00:24] Governing well and moving fast aren't trade-offs. [00:28] They're complimentary when done right. [00:30] That is governance that helps you go. Visit onetrust.com backslash governance. [00:37] I'm Gilbert Cruz, and this is the Sunday Special. I could not be more excited about today's episode. Producers, cue the spooky music. [00:51] I love Halloween. I love the spooky vibes. I love candy. I specifically love like mini Heath bars. [01:06] Here with me is Eric Piepenberg. He is the horror movie columnist at The Times. Hi, Eric. Hello, Gilbert. And our first returning guest. What an honor, Jason Zinneman, a critic at large and the author of the book, Shock Value, How a Few Eccentric Outsiders Give Us Nightmares, Conquered Hollywood, and Invented Modern Horror. Why is this subtitle so long?

[01:36] I'm the right. Zootalore. Welcome, Jason. Good to be here. [01:45] Okay, I brought the two of you on here for a very particular reason. [01:53] Today, we're going to come up with the definitive list of the greatest horror franchises in cinema history. [02:01] According to us three, we're going to make this list. We're all going to agree. We're going to get along. And then we'll all hug at the end. [02:09] Maybe. Maybe? Maybe. We'll see. Gotta keep some suspense, Gilbert. You're right. You're right. [02:15] Before we jump into this task, and it is a hearty task, I want to know how you all are feeling about the current state of horror movies. Like, how are we feeling about where the genre is right now? [02:27] In this year, 2025. [02:30] Eric. [02:30] I'm feeling good about it. I think we are in a sort of prolonged golden age of horror right now. The period that sort of started with Get Out, I think, is continuing. And when I think about just this year alone, Weapons is just one of the best horror movies I've seen in quite some time. We're seeing a lot of new faces, new ways of seeing horror. Jason, do you think so? [03:00] or maybe the olden days, yes, but I have to say, if I was to sum up the era right now in a word, it would be respectable, which is in both senses of the word. We're in an era of prestige, Oscar-bait horror. Sinners, weapons, Frankenstein, all are going to be in the conversation. This is not in the disreputable era, right? But if you judge a horror era by its mediocrities, it's not so bad

[03:30] Animals, which is like another shark movie. I just watched this movie Drop, which again, is not going to last the test of time. It's a set all in one bad date, but it kind of works as a thriller. So I think it's been a better year than the last couple, I would say. Yeah, it is interesting because both of you talked about these sort of big studio horror movies, Sinners, Weapons, the latest in the Final Destination franchise, which we will talk about, [04:00] Yeah. [04:15] You had a movie together, which was a Dave Franco, Alison Brie movie that was sold. I think it was one of the first movies sold at this year's Sundance Film Festival for a lot of money. So it feels like the studios are putting out pretty good horror. Indies are putting out pretty good horror. The days of Blumhouse being the maker of cheap horror movies alone has sort of faded a little bit because horror is a reliable box office draw. [04:45] small studio, you know that there is this very rabid fan base that everyone has sort of gotten into the game. I thought the most interesting thing [04:52] podcast I heard about the horror genre now this year was Jason Blum went on Matt Bellany's podcast, The Town, to talk about why the sequel to Megan, Megan 2, flopped. Yeah, and this is Jason Blum, who is sort of the man behind Blumhouse, which is produced and distributed a bunch of horror movies this century. Yeah, right, exactly. Paranormal Activity, Insidious, a bunch of other stuff.

[05:22] horror was the way to go or gone. And for Jason Blum to say that is really something that he said that now with all the competition, you need an event. And so you actually need to have an expensive horror. You need to really make a difference. I know a lot of people who disagree with that, and that caused a lot of waves. But the fact that he said it suggested there was some anxiety among the horror establishment about, okay, where's the next Blair Witch paranormal activity, etc. Yeah, I would say sort of on the flip side of the big pictures, I would say, [05:52] one of the nice things about doing this column is that I get to discover under the radar indie movies. I'm thinking of a movie like Bleeding, which came out earlier this year as this vampire story about told through the eyes of addiction. Good Boy, this new movie about this dog who goes to a haunted house. These small movies. Look, every month I have, I would say, from 15 to 20 brand new movies that are streaming to choose from. And that doesn't include the bigger movies, [06:22] directors are just doing this small little movie that to me, in some ways, is far more effective and scary than a movie like Together, which I didn't really like. That to me is what's exciting, that you have young faces who are using some of the horror conventions, but telling them in new, very disturbing ways. So I think we need to move to the meat of this conversation.

[06:52] Thank you. [06:53] So here's what we're going to do. [06:55] We have a list here of a couple dozen or so horror franchises that the group of us came up with. And listeners, I just want to say here right at the front, if your favorite franchise isn't on here... [07:06] I don't know what to say. The show can only be so long. These franchises are arranged chronologically. And the goal here is to eventually get to a list of what we consider to be the 10 best horror franchises of all time. [07:36] before we make a decision. [07:38] And for the sake of this discussion, I'm defining a franchise as a series of related films, [07:44] There's one film that results in multiple sequels that have recurring villains or recurring heroes or recurring locations. Does that sound right to the two of you? [07:54] I think that's a terrible definition. Okay. Great. [08:00] No, I think... All right, so this podcast is going to be three hours long. [08:06] Well, I guess let's start to begin. I think it's a good start. You asked when we were doing this, when does a horror movie... [08:16] franchise begin. [08:17] And to me... [08:19] Among the universal monster movies...

[08:23] that in the start in 1931, which, you know, Frankenstein, Dracula, Jekyll and Hyde. The first one to have a major follow up is Bride of Frankenstein. [08:38] As soon as you have Bride of Frankenstein, to me, that's the first one. Yeah. And I'm not sure that qualifies. I think it does. I do think it qualifies. I think if you look back at all the Universal Monster movies, [08:53] has the feel of a franchise. You have Bride of Frankenstein, as you mentioned, Son of Frankenstein. You have Frankenstein meeting the Wolfman eventually. You have this world before we ever thought about interconnected universes in which, you know, there's a house style. Characters are interacting with one another. You have essentially direct sequels to some of these movies. It feels like this is the beginning. But what ties it all together in me is the monster and the character in a way that I [09:23] include like young Frankenstein in the way I like to include Sean of the Dead in the Dead series. I don't want to go by the rules of Hollywood producer. Yeah, but you understand that we need to have rules here, right? I am whores about breaking rules, Gilbert, and that's what I'm here for. No, I'll go along with whatever definition you have. Okay. Eric, we know who the chaos agent is. [09:47] Can we agree universal franchise is? [09:50] should proceed. I think it should proceed. I hear you, Jason. I also think you make some really good points, but the answer is yes. For our purposes here, let's continue on that line. Okay. We're going to move to the

[10:02] Early 1960s, 1960, in fact, when one of the first slasher movies, the first slasher movie, if we consider Psycho, Alfred Hitchcock's all-time classic to be a slasher movie. We all go a little mad sometimes. [10:18] Came out in 1960. Haven't you? [10:20] No one thought it would be a franchise, but starting in the early 80s, you had Psycho 2, Psycho 3, and then Psycho 4 at the beginning, which was a prequel TV movie. This is very weird. We're going to encounter some of these. It's a franchise where the first movie is... [10:34] One of the greatest movies ever. [10:36] of all time. [10:37] As a franchise, as something that is like all held together. [10:42] I don't know that I would put it on the list, but I'm looking at Jason and I know. Well, no. Among horror nerds, Psycho 2 has developed a re-evaluation. You know, famous Quentin Tarantino prefers it to Psycho. And he's not the only one. I watched it again. It's definitely not better than the first one. But it's a very good movie. It really digs into the things that the original does not. Yeah. [11:06] And I would also argue Gus Van Sant's equally disliked, you know, shot by shot remake. I admire the ambition of that. I'm not saying it's my top 10, but I think that Psycho and Psycho 2 plus the Gus Van Sant 3 and 4 are terrible. Make it a worthy franchise, along with, obviously, you know, one of the most important horror movies ever. We're going to put this one on the bubble. [11:31] Does that feel right? That feels fine with me. Yeah, I'm good with that. The next one, the Night of the Living Dead series. ...have concluded that in all cases, the killers are eating the flesh of the people they murdered. Repeating this later... George Romero's extremely low-budget movie that kicked off an entire subgenre within horror, the zombie movie.

[12:01] later. Right. Yeah. [12:03] Next, The Exorcist, 1973. [12:13] First time I saw it. [12:15] was one of the scariest experiences I've ever had. I've been chasing that experience ever since for the rest of my life. Are you religious, Gilbert? I grew up Catholic. There you go. That makes a difference. I got it. It does make a difference. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Big difference, yeah. [12:27] I think it's worth putting on this list. I think I don't love the films after the original so much. I know, Jason, I think you picked a jump scare from the Exorcist films as one of your favorite jump scares recently. Exorcist 3 has one of the best jump scares ever. Which, look, watching those few minutes of that scene, I think, are truly one of the scariest things I've ever seen. So I appreciate that it has one of those scenes. But I don't love them. But is it in this discussion? Thumbs up. [12:57] thumbs up for one reason. One of the things I like about a franchise is when there's terrible movies in it. I don't like... This is good. Exorcist 2, all I can say is James Earl Jones wears a B-suit. [13:09] It is a locust suit. Actually, in Exorcist 2: The Heretic, he wears a locust suit. Okay, that alone, right, that image alone, I think, should qualify it to be under consideration as like a memorable [13:25] It's a memorable movie. Eric's absolutely right. The third one has this one scene that's memorable, more memorable than most horror movies. I don't think it's going to end up being one top 10, but I would say we should consider it. All right. I'm just going to say the next one, which is the Texas Chainsaw Massacre, Toby Hooper's film from 1974. This should continue. So we're going to keep this one going.

[13:48] Jaws. [13:55] sea jaw. What are you doing? A producer's mouth's agape. Look, I have confessed this before, so this is not breaking news, but I have a terrible, horrible, I have a severe shark phobia. And I remember sitting in Dairy Queen in Cleveland, Ohio, looking at the poster of the giant jaws with that tiny little lady up at the top. Yeah, iconic poster. Iconic poster. It has scarred me for life. [14:25] me. Why would they mean? Why would a shark be in a swimming pool? Toilets. I'm telling you, it's a severe. Don't trigger me. I'm going to I'm going to make an executive decision here. The first movie [14:37] I would say one of the great horror movies, and then you have three terrible sequels. This doesn't feel like a horror franchise to me. It feels like a shark franchise. The Omen, 1976. Look at me, Damien. It's all for you. [14:55] You love this, the first omen. I thought the prequel that came out recently, the first omen directed by Arkasha Stevenson, was fantastic. Fantastic. I agree. The original omen is a good horror movie, and then you had a bunch of... [15:11] not good stuff. So I actually don't know. It's one of the more famous franchises from the 70s. I actually don't know if I would sort of push it ahead. Look, I've laid out a few things I think are important. One that I think we all agree is sort of cultural footprint. And I'm not sure The Omen has that. Yeah, it's like the avatar of horror movies. No cultural footprint. 1977's The Hills Have Eyes. This is the first of several Wes Craven franchises on this list.

[15:41] I got strong opinions on this It should be on the list And I'm going to say there's going to be some West Craven franchises that other people Are going to want to put on that I'm not I'm not happy with where this is going already Here's my case [16:01] the original and the reboot [16:05] are both great. [16:06] The reboot, the Alexandra Aja. There's a movie about a plan of cannibals that live in the desert. And, you know, it's sort of building on some Texas Chainsaw elements. But I think it's a great franchise because it has this, you know, a great movie. It has a crummy sequel. And the fact that it has a successful reboot, which I don't think we'll be able to say about that many. Have you seen these? I haven't. I think it does not belong in this list. Like The Omen, I don't consider it a franchised. [16:36] necessarily, I think. I hear what you're saying, Jason. I don't think it belongs here for the similar. Same reasons as... Let's give it a yellow. I appreciate Jason's passion. Yeah, I do too. How dare you, Eric. [16:50] See, here's the thing about Jason. He's so smart and a very, like, he's a classy thinker where I'm like, I like monster movies because heads explode because it's stupid. That is not. That's kind of my sort of take on it. Here's the thing about Eric. You might know this, but he's from [17:06] leave when I'm a rube card. He's smarter than any of us. His horror column, I never miss. Must read. So don't fall for this. He's just trying to get Hillside Eyes out of here. Put Hillside Eyes on the list.

[17:21] It's on the bubble. [17:23] 1978's Halloween. You know, it's Halloween. I guess everyone's entitled to one good scare, huh? In the running for the most influential horror movie franchise, one of the most influential horror movie franchises, [17:36] This is just an automatic. We will discuss this later. [17:39] We should move this along. Correct. Okay. Phantasm. [17:45] I've been waiting for you. [17:48] This is the one with the tall man who's creepy looking and there's these flying balls that have spikes. [17:54] I'm going to say Stone Cold Classic, most underrated horror film of the 70s. Sure, I second that. What? The Toll Man is one of the great horror movie villains. [18:03] It should be. It should be if the world we live in a fair world, Gilbert. All right. We live in a just world. We the tall man would be talked about the way Michael Myers and Leatherface are. Phantasm one. Great. Phantasm two is great. Just surreal, trippy imagery. Maybe the best mirror scare of all time, which is no small thing. These have straight to video sequels. Do we feel like those counts as part of a sweetens the pot? [18:33] Absolutely. I put Phantasm as a franchise, and we can talk about it, above Halloween. I... [18:39] Hmm. I'm fighting words. I literally hear you struck mute. I mean, I got a whole argument for it, but we can wait. I'm usually fast with the comeback. I don't know what to say about that. All right. Let's let's put this on on the bubble as well.

[18:53] The Amityville Horror, 1979. [18:57] It's the passage to hell! [19:02] Here's the thing about the Amityville Horror. I counted. There are approximately 70 sequels. Yeah. Amityville is the name of a town on Long Island and you can't copyright the name of a town. [19:17] Correct. Amityville has become the shorthand for just the scary. And then plus this other thing, there's the Amityville Karen, there's the Amityville Christmas Vacation, there's the Amityville Gas Chamber. I mean, there's just like these ridiculous films made for $2 that you just slap on the word Amityville, right? The town isn't happy about that. But that's okay. Some of the movies are great. Most of them are bad. But as a franchise, yes. You guys are out of your mind. [19:47] So now Eric's not smart. Eric's a rude. No, not a rude, but he makes a good argument. He's almost persuaded me with a 70. That's crazy. I have no idea. That is a very strong case for it. But I'm going to say Haunted House, there's several Haunted House franchises that are better than this one. Okay. And I think that's part of why its cultural currency, which was huge once upon a time, has diminished. I would say it's not even the most successful horror franchise about ever. [20:16] A medieval horror. All right. Let's put it on the bubble. When there's a wholesale agreement, we'll move it forward. When there's disagreement, we'll put it on the bubble. Alien, 1979, first movie, Skunko Classic. Yes, move on. We'll move it forward. We're in the 80s now, the height of the slasher film. And we are going to come upon a couple of the all-time franchises, although I think Jason might disagree with one or two. No, no, no. Friday the 13th. Move it forward. Correct.

[20:46] Poltergeist. They're here. I don't know about this one. It doesn't feel like it's a franchise worth talking about. I'm kind of on the same page with you on that. Okay. [20:57] The Evil Dead. Why have you disturbed our sleep? For sure. Definitely qualifies. Okay. 1984, A Nightmare on Elm Street. Please, God. This is God. [21:14] I am a fan of the first one, which I think is... [21:17] tremendous. I know, Eric, you are a fan of the second one. I am a fan of Freddy's Revenge. Yeah, we're I got a gate up for a second. The second Nightmare on Elm Street is considered the gay one. The it is not subtext. It is text. And that is what I really enjoy about it. So I think for sure, Nightmare on Elm Street, especially the second one, which I think is influential in a lot of ways that I'm not sure people fully appreciate. And I would add that for me, it was I think a [21:47] where the last one is my favorite. This is New Nightmare. New Nightmare, which I think all the credit that goes to Scream should go to Nightmare on Elm Street. New Nightmare was doing meta winking horror before Scream, and Freddy was a comic character before. It was basically turned into a comedy. [22:13] I sort of like the zigs and zags of it,

[22:17] The next one, it's a bit of an odd one, but I'm going to throw it in here. 1986's Manhunter, which is a Michael Mann movie that's really a crime movie, but it starts what will become a horror franchise five years later with The Silence of the Lambs, which is one of the only horror movies to ever win Best Picture. The thing that connects all of these, of course, is Hannibal Lecter, played by Brian Cox in Manhunter, and then Anthony Hopkins for the rest of the movies. You fly back to school now, little starling. [22:47] Fly, fly, fly. [22:50] Is this a franchise that feels like it belongs in the all-time conversation? [22:55] I'm going to say no, but I would highly recommend people watch the Brian Cox scene where the detective comes in to visit him in the prison. [23:16] And then watch the same, the Jodie Foster coming in to see Hannibal Lecter in Silence of the Lambs. Do you know what you look like to me with your good bag and your cheap shoes? You look like a robe, a well-scrubbed, hustling robe with a little taste. [23:32] to see [23:33] Two genius actors doing the same thing in different ways. It's a bit. I don't think of it as horror. It's almost like too classy for horror. Yeah, that's true. Is that this classiness get in the way a bit? Yeah, for me, part of the appeal of horror is to be disreputable. And if something is trying to be too classy, I just don't find that enjoyable.

[23:53] Speaking of disreputable, I think the next movie would fall in that category. It's 1987's Hellraiser. [24:00] Of course, about an evil puzzle box that when you manipulate it, it calls a bunch of demons. Explorers in the further regions of experience. Demons to some. Angels to others. I think that's right. I'm not a big fan of the Hellraiser. I think those sort of fancy production design, it all looks a little too party city for me. I don't know. It's just not my kink. So, yeah, I think I'm going to pass on that. You don't like the leather? No. You don't like the chains? [24:30] stuff and the headgear and the makeup. No, it just looks like cabaret plus party city plus busted. So no, we're not going to move Hellraiser along. 1988's Child's Play. Hi, I'm Chucky. Want to play? Yeah, this is so great. Again, I'm going to gate up here. I mean, like where this, where this franchise goes in terms of queer representation, in terms of non-binary, and [25:00] And I think without the entire Child's Play franchise, I think queer horror would be sort of missing something. So for me, I think for those reasons alone and because it's Chucky's kids love dressing up as Chucky. So for those reasons, like to see a little kid with a plastic knife waddling down the street with that wig and the overalls. I mean, stuff of my nightmares.

[25:25] Child's Play is in some ways it feels such a franchise. Yeah, it is. Because to me, a franchise is also not just the movies. It's the dolls. It's the posters. It's the appearances. You know, I don't even know all the things that Chucky is has his hand in, but he feels it feels bigger than the than what's on the screen. [25:46] uh we're going into the 90s now sorry to leave the 80s just the best decade uh candy man be my victim i think the original candy man is really fantastic but i'm not sure if the subsequent films really stand up to to the original uh so much uh and i i just don't see it as something canonical that we would want to put as part of the that we'd want to include in part of this list uh okay we'll [26:16] rules that one must abide by in order to successfully survive a horror movie. For instance, this modern slasher franchise is... [26:25] The one that most reminds people. [26:30] of the tropes of a horror movie. You watch horror movies in part because particularly with franchises, you know, they're predictable. And this franchise wears all of that on its sleeve. And there's something that is entertaining, entertaining, [26:41] and enjoyable about that. The characters that have lasted across six movies now, I think people have great affection for Neve Campbell and Courtney Cox. I don't dislike the screenwriters. And the Arquette, whose first name I cannot recall. No, David Arquette. No, I think actually, if the measure was...

[27:02] the best movies, Scream would be among, I think that the quality control is not bad for Scream. I just think it's a bit basic. I think it's not, I don't, I, the, uh, personally, I think to a certain kind of horror person, Scream gets on our nerves because there's this idea that horror never had humor. [27:23] And it's, listen to this conversation. So many of these movies are hilarious. If it's calling card, is it added this humor, and it's not that funny, you know, then what is it? [27:35] Eric? [27:36] I don't find them funny. I find the wink-wink stuff too much. Ghost-faced, again, looks like something you'd buy at Walgreens. You can buy it at Walgreens. That's true, so I am not going to advocate for that. Wow. Okay. I predict this will be controversial with some of our listeners, but we set a set of rules, and we are going to abide by them. I'm surprised Scream is not moving forward. [28:06] in 2000. But what if it was our time? What if we were not meant to get off that plane? [28:11] It was sort of in the gutter for a while, and then this year's movie... [28:15] Bloodlines really sort of brought it back. And I think that's why I would save it for me. Final Destination Bloodlines was really one of the funniest horror movies I've seen in a while. That first scene atop that building and just where to the very end where there's this train that comes out of nowhere. I mean, it's so funny and so accomplished in the way that it marries horror and comedy. So if I think for Bloodlines alone, I would say absolutely.

[28:45] Screaming out loud at something ridiculous that just happened in like a wonderful way. So we'll move it ahead. Next one. Oh, God, these. Saw. I want to play a game. Here's what happens. I mean, it's the most franchisey of franchises, at least unless you count some of those in the 80s. So I would say you have to have Saw on the list. Yeah, and in some way it feels like a sister or a cousin to Final Destination. So I would say, yeah. Okay. Paranormal Activity, 2007. [29:15] I feel it breathing on me. I feel good about Paraguay Activity. I think, for me, that's top ten material, I think. I agree. Especially because we didn't put Blair Witch on here. We've got to have one of those two. Insidious, the next series that James Wan's or have dealt with. I can still hear that voice. [29:35] Thank you. [29:36] Just because we can't have both Insidious and The Conjuring, I would say I would err on the side of The Conjuring. You got the very wise. It's very wise of you. Thank you. I think that's right. And I really want Patrick Wilson to come back to Broadway. I'm sorry. Yeah. I saw him in Oklahoma and he needs to come back and sing for us. So you guys are the perfect, perfect parent to talk about both those things. The VHS series. [30:06] Emily! Emily!

[30:21] 2013 is the conjuring. She possessed the mother to kill the child. She misses killing every night. That's what the bruise marks are. She's feeding off of her. I'm just for the sake of time going to say this one has to be on there. Okay. The third series that James Wan has worked on 2013 is the purge. Any and all crime, including murder will be legal for 12 continuous. I'm just going to say no. Okay. I'm going to say no. Great. A quiet place. [30:51] The last one bored me. So I'd say no. I'm going to say not yet. Guys, I love how we're getting really, really... [30:57] Vicious here right at the end. And then 2018's Terrifier. He thinks what he's doing is funny because he's laughing. But I know it's not funny because they're all dead. The hell awaits him. One of the most out of nowhere surprising horror success stories. [31:11] in the past many years. These are extremely low-budget movies, extremely violent movies, [31:17] and Gori, and Terrifier 2 and Terrifier 3, [31:21] have made a ton of money at the American box office. [31:23] I love the idea of Damien Leone, the director of these films, being on this list, because I do think Art the Clown has become a villain. And I think he's the newest villain that I think you could put somewhere in the lineage of Freddy and Jason. I don't think it for our purposes, I wouldn't put on the list, but I cannot wait for more Terrifier films to come out. I have a strong stomach, but for these movies, I get a little queasy when I watch these. I agree with everything.

[31:53] All right. So, Jason, Eric, we just went through so many franchises, but somehow we've narrowed it down to 15 franchises. [32:04] that we've agreed we're going to move forward to the debate that we're about to have about what the 10 greatest horror movie franchises of all time are. And I'm going to read those 15 very quickly. [32:17] The Universal Monsters franchise, the Night of the Living Dead series, The Exorcist, Texas Chainsaw Massacre, Halloween, and the Night of the Living Dead. [32:27] Alien, Friday the 13th, The Evil Dead series, Nightmare on Elm Street, Child's Play, Final Destination, Saw, Paranormal Activity, VHS, and The Conjuring films. This is a slightly perverse list, but gather your thoughts. We are going to take a break, and when we come back, the three of us are going to pick our definitive list that no one will argue with of top 10 horror movie franchises. [32:57] Thank you. [32:59] you [33:03] Planning for retirement and all the things that go with it can be stressful. That's why Fisher Investments partners with you to understand your goals and needs so that they can build a tailored plan that helps you achieve a comfortable retirement. Whether you need help with financial planning, estate planning, or Social Security, Fisher has specialists to help. [33:21] Fisher Investments. Now that's clearly different money management. Learn more at FisherInvestments.com. Investing in securities involves the risk of loss. Fast is only right when it's not reckless. Right now, pressure to adopt AI quickly is real.

[33:37] Your competitors feel it. Your board feels it. [33:41] Moving fast without the right governance in place isn't a strategy. [33:45] it's a risk. OneTrust provides the visibility into what's moving across your organization, the intelligence to understand what it means, and the guardrails to keep everything in bounds. [33:56] So teams move with speed and confidence. That's AI-ready governance. Governance that helps you go. [34:02] Visit OneTrust.com backslash governance. Remember when Orlando's theme parks were just a dream? Or when Florida oranges were picked by hand? How about the first rocket to launch from Cape Canaveral? We do. Seacoast Bank has been a part of Florida since 1926. 100 years of weathering hurricanes and heat waves right beside our customers. Growing our communities together. We look forward to the next 100 years of banking better together in Florida. [34:32] Here's to learn more. Member FDIC. [34:36] Jason and Eric, we've just gone through every single important horror movie franchise, at least according to me and the two of you and the producers of the show. And we've narrowed it down to a slim list of 15. And we're going to make some cuts so that at the end of this, we have a nice, clean, perfect, respectable list of the 10 best horror movie franchises ever seen. [35:00] parentheses, according to us. [35:02] How are we going to pare this down? We are going to go around the room, and each of us is going to stump for one franchise that they believe absolutely needs to be on here. And you're also going to have your vote for what you think should be removed.

[35:18] You should make a convincing argument. [35:20] Jason, we'll start with you. So one I think needs to be on is Friday the 13th. The counselors weren't paying any attention. They were making love while that young boy drowned. [35:35] his name was jason well i think franchises i think friday the 13th it has all the qualities but it has the classic uh villain who happens to share my name so i'm a little biased okay uh and also i like franchises that are silly and go to a lot of crazy places jason went to space jason went to hell jason did met freddie he went to manhattan he went to manhattan of all places so [36:05] is being taken seriously. [36:07] And not have Friday the 13th. So I would vote for that one. Okay. [36:11] And do you want to say now which one you think should go? Yeah, I'll say The Exorcist. Sorry, Gilbert. [36:21] it's a great movie it's not a great franchise you know what i'm a peacemaker let's get rid of the exorcist all right we can do this guy we can do this uh eric [36:35] Yes, I would say we need to keep child's play. I think you have a villain that is hilarious and also creepy. I think there's a through line through the films. I think it does touch on some queer aspects, which I personally like. And so I think for those reasons, I think it needs to stay.

[36:53] And if you know what's good for you, you are going to love, honor, and obey. I wouldn't marry you if you had the buddy of G.I. Cho. [37:02] Hey, Raggedy Ann, you looked in the mirror lately? Now's not the time to get picky. [37:08] I vouched for this or I advocated for this, but I would actually take off the VHS films. I love an anthology series, but I think maybe that is one that could go. Also, we have at least one other found footage franchise here, so I would take VHS off. [37:26] Jason. I agree. Okay. Let's take it off. So much agreement here. I am going to advocate for a nightmare on Elm street. What's wrong? Joey feeling tongue tied. [37:41] The first movie, one of my all time favorite horror movies, the, [37:46] I think, of the major slashers, [37:49] As we think about them, Jason Voorhees from the Friday the 13th movies, Michael Myers from the Halloween movies, maybe even Leatherface from the Texas Chainsaw Massacre movies. Freddy Krueger is the only one with personality. [38:01] He was the only one that has a little... [38:03] a little verb, a little pop. And that's important, I think, if you are going to be a character that holds a franchise over multiple movies. You're right, Jason. He gets silly. He becomes a comedic character. I think that comedy and horror... [38:20] coexist very easily and i know you agree oh i mean i agree that comedy and horror two sides of the same coin the structure of a suspense sequence that builds tension and leads to a scream is analogous to the structure of a joke which builds tension and then leads to a laugh and uh i think you see that in a nightmare on elm street which uh you know it does it melds them very well and

[38:50] talent uh is for for a big you know hot blockbuster franchise it's quite like surreal and uh and i yeah i agree i think your point about personality is is is a good one that you didn't see that before i also think there's something about these movies you use the right word surreal particularly in the first movie the fact that you're operating with dream logic for much of these movies just gives [39:20] ones exist in the real world and you just have a bunch of people getting murdered in, you know, very ornate ways. No, it means you can do things visually you can't otherwise. I mean, I think you see like the arms to the walls. A lot of the vocabulary, cinematic vocabulary of horror comes from Nightmare, which comes from Polanski, which, you know, has the look. You can watch it with a sound elf and it's great. So I think it's tremendously influential to. Okay. So that is the [39:50] And I would remove Saw. I recently rewatched the first one. [39:56] Which is fine, but I think the conceit of these films over 10 movies is just a bit more than I... [40:04] care to experience. I don't think they iterate on the original idea in particularly interesting ways. I think the Final Destination franchise does this better, although they're two very different things. I... [40:18] Say take out saw.

[40:20] I'm fine with that. Jason is rubbing his lips. It feels wrong. Yeah. Why? Well, because we're not here talking about a horror movie. We're here talking about horror movie franchises. And as you point out before, every year you could expect a Saw movie like you could expect Halloween. Well, it's around the Saw movie. [40:42] was as significant as the Saw movies. So you're right. There is a consistency. And a lot of this podcast I've been going on about how much I admire movies that zag, right? Yeah. But if we're honest... [40:54] The reason that most of these horror franchises have sequel after sequel is to give people more of the same. Yeah. And the Saw movies did that more effectively than anything past the 80s classic slasher movies. You know what, Jason? You're right. Let's add Saw back on. My favorite three words. And we are going to take Alien off. Oh, I'm fine with that. OK, I'm fine with that. You want to argue? This is what happens. [41:24] Alien's gone. Also, I think Alien is more science fiction. And if we're going to be sticklers about definitions, to me, it's a little more of the alien creature type movie. And so to me, yes, there are horror elements. Yes, there are crossovers of the two. But to me, that's the maybe top 10 science fiction franchise.

[41:54] to stay on and one that should fall off. I'm going to advocate for paranormal activity to stay on the list. Oh, okay. Scratch myself. [42:04] Did you hear that? [42:05] Uh, yeah. It's okay. [42:11] It's okay. It's all right. It's all right. It's okay. [42:15] It is a found footage film. The first one is really, really good. I also love that it came out of nowhere to become this really big hit and has spawned subsequent films. And now a stage show, which is... Is that true? It's at the Chicago Shakespeare Theater right now. It's coming to D.C. later on. I haven't seen it, so I don't know if it's good or not, [42:35] transfer this found footage story, which I don't know how you do that on stage, but I'm very curious to see that. Theater keeps coming up, Jason. I don't know what's going on here, but like anything that has a show attached to it, I sort of say, you know what, let's keep that on the list. And these are the films that popularized, in my mind at least, someone getting dragged off by an off-screen presence. Whenever I think about that happening, these are the movies that I think about. [43:05] I'm struggling with this because I love the Universal Monsters, but I almost wonder if that's not quite a franchise. I used to stay up. This is ageism. [43:16] I was just about to say, I used to stay up for the 11.30 p.m. late night movie with my grandmother who loved the Universal Monsters. Channel 43, back when they showed movies. Where was this? This was in Cleveland, Ohio. Right, got it. And I have such warm memories of being with my grandmother and watching these films, so it pains me to take that off. But I'm not sure if it's a franchise. I get the spirit of it. They're great movies, but is it a franchise for our purposes? Yeah.

[43:45] I say no. [43:46] Okay. [43:47] Let's strike it off. [43:48] Jason, we're coming back to you. One for, one against. Um, one for, uh, Evil Dead. [43:58] Groovy. [43:58] . [43:59] The first movie is a great horror movie. The second movie, you were talking about horror and comedy. There's no movie period that's captured in live action the Looney Tunes better than the Evil Dead sequel. There's a sequence, people can look it up on YouTube, of the main character, Ash, played by Bruce Campbell, who is a brilliant actor in these movies, where his hand gets possessed and he fights with his hand. [44:29] of physical comedy that's still wrapped up. It's a possessed hand, and it still is a horror movie. And then, you know, it keeps going. It shifted again into kind of an evil adventure, and then you've got the reboots, the two which I think are more kind of gnarly horror films. I don't think there's a bad Evil Dead movie. Also a musical. Also a musical. Also a musical. And a TV show. And a TV show. This is the last time I invite theater people on this podcast. [44:59] Evil Dead has to be on the list. Okay. And to take off the list... God, this is getting very hard. [45:11] Oh, no, it's not. I would say Texas Chainsaw Massacre, which is one of my favorite movies of all time. But I have a theory that Texas Chainsaw and Halloween, they're both...

[45:23] The originals are so great and they're so distinct that they kind of haunt the rest of the franchise. And Texas Chainsaw Massacre, all the rest of them pale in comparison. I would say the only the most interesting thing about Texas Chainsaw Massacre is it's the movie that's beloved by filmmakers that they've had the hardest time trying to capture what makes it great. [45:53] trilogy, X really is an homage to Texas Chainsaw and captures the gnarly, gritty, gross, you know, backwoods element of it. So anyways, and that's those are that's X, Pearl and Maxine. Correct. Yeah, correct. I would say, like, if you want to get to a slightly artier kind of franchise that that would make it. But I say take off Texas Chainsaw. [46:14] Okay, that was unexpected. [46:17] But I respect your decision. Okay, so I think we're officially at 10 on the list now. But I'm going to use my pick anyway to stump for The Conjuring movie. [46:36] For people of a certain generation, maybe no one of that generation is in this room, these are the... [46:42] Their franchise, it is the sort of modern ghost demon franchise. And... [46:48] It just feels like it would be it's it's sort of undeniable. It would be sick and perverse to leave him off, which would be fine. Given the topic that we are discussing here. Maybe appropriate. I know. Maybe we're being too responsible. The first two movies, The Conjuring and Conjuring 2, I think are quite good. The first one in particular. But when we're talking about franchises, this is you have these characters. They're sort of moving out in and out of all of these movies. You have four Conjuring films, all starring Patrick Wilson and Vera Farmiga.

[47:18] as just the cutest little spirit [47:22] exercising couple. You have two films in the Nun series. There are three Annabelle films. There are some people that consider the Curse of La Llorona to be part of the series. It has become sort of this universe in and of itself. It just feels like the modern definition of a franchise. We haven't hit the Conjuring TV series yet. I don't know anyone dressing up as Ed and Lorraine Warren for Halloween. Maybe I'll do that this year, but this is the one that I would keep on. [47:52] We have our 10, but obviously we cannot end the show without talking about our last two franchises. And it is insane that we have saved Halloween until the very end here. [48:04] What's the other one Halloween? The Night of the Living Dead series So the Halloween series I think when most people think of horror movie franchises Is one of the ones that automatically comes to mind [48:16] The first is, again, a hard classic. And then you go in some weird directions with some weird sequels. Halloween, I think, is such a perfect movie. But I also would make the case for Halloween 3, Season of the Witch, which has nothing to do with the Michael Myers world at all. It's about basically these jack-o'-lantern masks, hoods that you put on, and there's mind control. [48:46] Jason I think you made the point that A franchise that can sort of go outside of its world And be something else Shapeshift I think this is the perfect example of that And I think that's why for me Halloween I think is maybe one of my favorite franchises I'm so glad Eric brought up this movie Because when I heard that you guys wanted me to come into a franchise I re-watched Season of the Witch Because I think it's the key turning point In the whole history of the franchise Because John Carpenter didn't want to make a sequel

[49:16] They twisted it on. He made the sequel, right, which was basically Halloween 2. It kind of took up right where Halloween 1 ended, made kind of the same movie, right? And he said, all right, I'll come back for Halloween 3, but only if we don't have Michael Myers. This has never been done before. And here's the key part. And after. [49:37] Because people came to see this. They go to see Michael Myers. And the only time you see Michael Myers in this movie is when one of the characters turns the TV set on, [49:46] Halloween and everyone was like that's the movie I want to see now I agree with everything Eric said I think season of which is a tremendously underrated movie really interesting on many counts some really uh trippy imagery in it but the lesson that the industry took from the failure of season of the witch is we're never going to let them do this again we got to have the music we got to have the Michael Myers ask and we'll let you mess around a little bit at the edges but it kind of ruined the franchise so I agree with all of Eric's premise but I come to the opposite [50:16] because of the season of the witch. [50:19] the rest of the Halloween franchise became less interesting to me, where let's compare it to Night of the Living Dead. When there's no more room in hell, the dead will walk near. [50:34] This is the rare movie where the sequel is better than the or more ambitious, certainly than the original. Dawn of the Dead is a tremendous movie.

[50:49] in terms of ambition and created not just one character, but a whole new character that was taken off, you know, in a million other directions. So I would say if I had to choose the Night of the Living Dead franchise, I would pick over Halloween, which seems crazy. But the one other thing... Well, we're not picking. They're both on the list. Oh, they're both on the list. Okay. Yeah. So let's review the final list. There have been a lot of lists. This is the final list. I'm going to read it out and you can tell me how you feel about all these together. [51:19] Night of the Living Dead. [51:20] Halloween, Friday the 13th, The Evil Dead, A Nightmare on Elm Street, Child's Play, Final Destination, Saw, Paranormal Activity, and The Conjuring. [51:33] These are our 10. [51:34] Are these our 10? Yeah, it's a good list. Yeah? I feel good about it. Yeah. Do you think anyone's going to get angry about this list? Oh, yeah, definitely. I should hope so. Okay. The producers look angry. [51:46] All right. We have come up with a definitive list. [51:50] Look up the definition of the word definitive list of the top 10 horror movie franchises of all time. Tweet it. Jason cinnamon. Okay. Or thread. [52:03] Listeners. Those of you who are not mad at the movies we left off, you can find both our master list. [52:08] and our top 10 in the show notes, so you can basically recreate this debate with your friends. We're going to take another break, and when we return, as we do every week, we're going to play a little game.

[52:28] All money managers are not the same, and when it comes to your retirement, Fisher Investments is clearly different. Fisher's dedicated team of investment specialists will work with you to tailor your portfolio to your unique long-term goals. And with the simple fee structure aligned with the value of your portfolio, they do better when you do better. Now that's different. Learn more at FisherInvestments.com. Fisher Investments, clearly different money management. Investing in securities involves the risk of loss. [52:58] Risk doesn't. For most organizations, that tension never goes away. [53:03] Every time a new AI capability appears, the pressure to move fast collides with the responsibility to move safely. [53:10] OneTrust is built for this moment. Their AI-ready governance platform provides context to understand your data, controls to stay ahead of risk, and confidence to act boldly. [53:21] Governing well and moving fast aren't trade-offs. [53:25] They're complimentary when done right. [53:27] That is governance that helps you go. Visit onetrust.com backslash governance. Remember when Orlando's theme parks were just a dream? Or when Florida oranges were picked by hand? How about the first rocket to launch from Cape Canaveral? We do. Seacoast Bank has been a part of Florida since 1926. 100 years of weathering hurricanes and heat waves right beside our customers. Growing our communities together. We look forward to the next 100 years of banking better together in Florida. [53:57] Visit seacoastbank.com slash 100 years to learn more. Member FDIC.

[54:04] Welcome back. Welcome to our hollow scream spook hack boo scare. [54:09] Oh, man. Oh, man. It's a regular Elvira over here. Here we go, D.I. [54:17] I've got Eric Piepenberg and Jason Zinneman here. They both look slightly uncomfortable because we're about to play a game. I've got three rounds for you, gentlemen. Please put your hands on your buzzers and let us begin. [54:39] Film Street. Let's see how much you know about the films on our list. What fictional Illinois town is the main setting of the Halloween franchise? Jason. Haddonfield. That is correct. Haddonfield. Next question. Chucky, the murderous doll at the center of the Child's Play franchise, is a possessed version of what doll manufactured by the Play Pals toy factory? Eric. Good guy doll. [55:09] Correct. The first Paranormal Activity movie's $194 million worldwide box office made it the most profitable movie of all time, displacing what other found footage horror movie? Eric. Blair Witch Project? The Blair Witch Project. This guy's quick on the draw. I know, I know. How many principal shooting locations from Friday the 13th Part 8, Jason Takes Manhattan, were actually in Manhattan? Jason.

[55:39] least one because he comes one one that is correct the time square subway the subway sequence yeah right exactly okay that was the end of round one round two is called the kills have eyes you guys should be ashamed of yourself i mean you know this is jimmy fallon's looking down his nose it was a mistake to have a comedy person on this on this episode i'm going to give you three ways [56:09] a franchise and you tell me the name of the franchise. So again, we do three ways that people die. Tell me the name of the franchise. Stabbed through the throat with an arrow, head frozen with liquid nitrogen and then shattered, swung around in a sleeping bag and smashed into a tree. Jason. That is Friday the 13th. That is correct. All of those kills [56:39] 13th franchise. Next. Turned into a cockroach and squished inside a roach motel, drowned in a waterbed, sliced by an animatronic claw hand. [56:51] Eric. Nightmare on Elm Street? Correct. Nightmare on Elm Street. This is close. Next. Strangled with a yo-yo. [57:00] Beaten to death with a yardstick, choked on a doll arm. Jason. Child's Play? Child's Play. Absolutely

[57:09] this round. Burned alive inside a tanning bed, flattened by a huge pane of glass, crushed by logs falling off the back of a truck on the highway. Eric. Final destination. Final destination. This is really close. You guys are neck and neck here. We're at our final round. It's called Child's Play. Some of these horror franchises contain some iconic, extremely creepy lines of dialogue. And as we all know, there's nothing scarier than a creepy [57:39] I found a little kid to creepily read some iconic horror movie dialogue for us. Please listen to the quote. Wait until the quote is over. And then tell me what movie it's from. [57:55] I ate his liver with some fava beans and a nice Chianti. [58:01] Jason. [58:02] Silence of the Lambs. The Silence of the Lambs. Correct. Next. Quote. They're coming to get you, Barbara. Jason. Neither living dead. Neither living dead. That is correct. [58:17] Next quote. All right, you primitive screwheads, listen up. You see this? This is my boomstick. [58:29] Really good line reading. You guys, you're both stumped. That is from Army of Darkness, the third evil dead film. I should have got it. Yeah, boomstick was the, uh, should have tipped you off. I was distracted by how good a performance that was. Okay, next clue. A boy's best friend is his mother.

[58:47] Jason Unless this is like a trick I'm going to say Psycho Psycho, that is correct That is a quote from Norman Bates And our final clue in this category And in the game overall It's alive It's alive [59:04] Bye. [59:04] Thank you. [59:05] *BEEP* [59:07] Jason. Frankenstein. That is correct. Frankenstein. Also, It's Alive, the great Larry Cohen movie. [59:16] That's not the one about the killer yogurt, is it? No, that's about the killer baby. Oh, right, right, right. Okay, my mistake. [59:24] you [59:25] Okay, our producers are telling us that we have a winner. [59:29] And that winner is... [59:31] Jason. Congratulations, Jason. You hold it out right at the end. Amazing. Amazing. [59:39] Jason, I have something to give you. Okay. It's a prize. [59:43] This is the ninth one of these that we have awarded. It is a cheap, tiny, plastic trophy with my face on it. We call it the Gilby. Oh, my God. And it is now yours. I'm so honored. I'm flattered. I'm humbled. Thank you. Thank you, Gilbert. [59:58] Those are all the emotions that that chief trophy are supposed to. It really feels like you get it from a gumball machine and then throw it away. It's a secret where we get it from. [1:00:11] Jason, Eric, thank you both for joining this fantastic conversation about great horror movie franchises. Great to be here. My pleasure. Yeah, it was a lot of fun. Thank you.

[1:00:23] Wait, before we go, if you had to pick a number one, what would it be? [1:00:28] I'm going to go with Evil Dead. Eric? I'm going to say Child's Play. [1:00:33] For me, Nightmare on Elm Street, all the way. One, two, Freddy's coming. [1:01:03] Rosalie Barron read all those scary lines from horror movies in our game. Original music by Dan Powell, Marion Lozano, Alicia Baetup, and Diane Wong. Special thanks to Paula Schumann. Thanks for listening. See you next week. [1:01:27] Planning for retirement and all the things that go with it can be stressful. That's why Fisher Investments partners with you to understand your goals and needs so that they can build a tailored plan that helps you achieve a comfortable retirement. Whether you need help with financial planning, estate planning, or social security, Fisher has specialists to help. [1:01:46] Fisher Investments. Now that's clearly different money management. Learn more at FisherInvestments.com. Investing in securities involves the risk of loss.